Can Panbo reader Rolf network the NavNet 3D version of MaxSea Time Zero straight to NN3D radar and GPS compass aboard his Regina 43 (as he graphically dreamed of above)? The idea seems conceivable given that NN3D radar scanners are independent Ethernet entities, and can even bridge in NMEA 2000 sensors, but I’ve confirmed from Furuno that you must have at least one of its NN3D processors in the system. That’s because only a Furuno MFD or Black Box can be the Master of a network, able to “act as a DHCP server and distribute IP address to any other Ethernet device (Radar Antenna, Sounder, Computer, ...).” MaxSea Time Zero is going to work nicely in an NN3D network, sharing charts and all sensor data, but it can only be a “slave” in terms of network architecture (and it also won’t be able to do some configuration tasks like aligning a scanner).
I don’t really think this is a significant limitation as it makes so much sense to have at least an MFD8 in the system for its ruggedness. But I suspect Rolf and others may be disappointed to learn that Time Zero will not actually be available until some time this Fall. On the other hand, if you want to start with MaxSea 12.5 now, Time Zero will in fact be version 13, with only the normal full step upgrade fees. Furuno is also having some trouble delivering all the NN3D processors boaters want. The orders placed in early March are now shipping as promised, but if you order an MFD8 or 12 today, it will not be delivered for an indeterminate length of time, possibly as long as several months. The “indeterminate” factor is because Furuno is working to ramp up production, but doesn’t yet know how well that will work. And of course there is an alternate explanation coming from a skeptic or two; i.e., that there are MFD performance issues and Furuno wants to limit the units installed just in case they have to replace them. It’s probably untrue, but persistent skeptics are sometimes right. Meanwhile, NN3D manuals are up and I’ve also learned the FI-50 instruments will ship in a month or two, with an MSRP of $595 apiece. And I’m pleased to add that in two weeks I’ll be spending a day off Cape Cod with NavNet 3D and a couple of its creators.
Posted by Ben on May 1, 2008 7:07 PM
Comments
I'll copy a email I received from MaxSea where they said the new Max Sea will available April. Now I know it's May, but did this release it in Europe before here??
From: marie.nanteuil@maxsea.fr
Subject: RE: MaxSea Software
Date: March 25, 2008 4:58:57 AM EDT
To: John Ford
-----Mensaje original-----
De: John Ford [mailto:]
Enviado el: martes, 25 de marzo de 2008 2:20
Para: info
Asunto: MaxSea Software
When does the new MaxSea software get released??
Posted by: John Ford at May 1, 2008 11:09 PM
Since MSTZ doesn't have radar overlays until sometime this summer, it's moot at the moment.
It may not be possible as Furuno says, but that particular reason seems very weak and/or problematic. There are any number of possible sources for DHCP servers, including the PC on which MSTZ is running.
If Furuno expects to be the Master of the Ethernet, they are going to run into conflicts with WiFi bridges, DSL routers, BGAN and all manner of other network gateways that must necessarily provide DHCP/NAT services.
Is Furuno expecting a dedicated "Furuno only" Ethernet, with non-Furuno traffic on a physically separate network? Shades of proprietary FurunoNet. Is Furuno expecting everyone to shut down all their Furuno devices and re-boot their PC before they access the net? That would be kind of odd since customers are supposed to accessing MyNavNet (www.navnet.com) for access to "premium benefits".
This is also contrary to what I was told at the Ft. Lauderdale show when I asked this question. I was told that using MSTZ would be functionally equivalent to an MFDxx and nobody mentioned that it would be necessary to have an MFD active on the network.
With regard to the upgrade from 12.5 to TZ, one dealer with whom I spoke recently contacted Furuno in response to my inquiry. They responded that based on the answer they got from Furuno, they could not sell me MaxSea 12.5 with any confidence that it would be a "normal" update. They advised waiting until they got a less ambiguous answer from Furuno.
Posted by: Russ at May 1, 2008 11:55 PM
This is a shame. I will shortly be spec'ing a system for an offshore racing yacht for launch next May and was hoping to go down this route to save weight. Does this mean that the only straight to PC option is still Nobeltec?
Posted by: Nat Ives at May 2, 2008 7:36 AM
On another note, I just completed a 1000 mile offshore trip up the East Coast in a new Riviera 45 with a Raymarine G-series network, including 2 G-series processors, 4kW Super HD radar, Raymarine AIS receiver, an ST70, and an Airmar weather station, among other equipment, and had flawless high performance all the way. The G-series is available now and awesome. Just my Raymarine-centric $0.02...
Posted by: Preston Calvert at May 2, 2008 11:16 AM
MaxSea appear to have a moving set of goal posts a lot over the last 2 months
We were told MaxSea will send us a new dealer dongle
Now its a software license each software will get 2 licenses that you can revoke every x days etc
Now my reliable contact at Furuno UK has said there will be NO upgrade from MaxSea 12.5 to TimeZero.
Posted by: Anonymous at May 2, 2008 3:38 PM
Well, I just got back from spending three hours at my dealer this morning comparing a Navnet 3D MFD12 against the Garmin 4000/5000 and the Raymarine E/G Series in a True Side-by-Side Shootout!!!
All I can say is that there is a New Sheriff In Town!!!
In overall performance, the Navnet 3D MFD12 was as good as the Raymarine G Series which was totally shocking. In terms of features, the MFD12 is much better than the G Series, E Series, Garmin 4000 and Garmin 5000. This doesn't even consider the Navnet 3D Black Box unit which I decided was more than I needed.
If speed is the overall performance factor, the MFD12 and the Raymarine G Series are close and the others are not in the same league! Zooming the Garmin took 25 seconds to redraw one screen with the Sat Photos turned on while the MFD12 never lost the image of the same area with photos and better detail!! Don't take my word for this fact, compare them for yourself.
In terms of features, concepts, and ideas packed into a chart plotter, Navnet is so far above the others, it is difficult to compare. It has Smart Raster charts which I love and had with my Northstar 962 but, the overall modes with 3D and the User Interface are simply amazing.
If the Furuno radar lives up to its name and the other revolutionary features I've read about, it is the product to beat as well.
You can argue technical babble about Networking but, Navnet 3D represents a true paradigm shift in the industry.
My dealer told me his biggest challenge will be getting enough of them and I think he is absolutely right.
Posted by: Navnet Believer at May 2, 2008 6:42 PM
I personally think having DHCP is a bad idea in any navigation suite. Options for statically assigned IP addresses seems important, in that if the DHCP server is down, the network is down, and therefore no navigation data what so ever. And since statically assigning IP addresses only gets confusing after the 256th address, I think there would be very few vessels that would run into this problem. Sometimes plug and play doesn't seem so wonderful.
As for those who asked about IP addresses/DHCP server interfering with other forms of standard ethernet internet communications, a secondary network isn't that unreasonable when looking at the cost of a usb to ethernet adapter (and usb hub if necessary).
Posted by: Matt at May 8, 2008 8:30 AM
Matt, IP's given out by DHCP typically have a lease term of x days, so you wouldn't automatically be down without the DHCP server. Also, static addressing can be implemented using any number of addresses (not just 254 - remember 0 and 255 are reserved), depending on the subnet mask being used.
Since sailors tend not to be network engineers and therefore not familiar with subnetting topics, I would suggest that using DHCP is the logical choice.
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